Ecological / Constraints Based Games Sharing

Kabir is a great guy. Very approachable and helpful. I’ve bounced a few ideas off of him for feedback re Eco D and CLA and he’s always willing to do so.

All I got to say is "Old school is the new school"

I am trying to refine my CLA approach. Its not eco and I don’t sign up for assumption that one approach is always better. My goal is to try to observe what is happening and adjust tasks and information accordingly.

I am testing various task related situational sparring or very exact small problem solving experiments. Very much like eco approach or CLA. Maybe major difference is that I try to explain what is happenening with a theory of grappling. I use Rob Biernacki’s theory. (Same as SBG and Ryan Hall and Richson.)

if this thread is alive I can share my experiments here.

In few months I am trying to start a kids program and use mostly game base approach (what ever you want to call it :-)

It would be interesting to read about your experiments and experiences and see the different games you use and how well your students do :)

kalel, post: 65153, member: 3023

It would be interesting to read about your experiments and experiences and see the different games you use and how well your students do :)

"De la Riva" is not a move. I think it as a control. So first assignment will be to control opponent in De la Riva. I do not care about delariva hook. So when controlling hook can come in. Person doing De la Riva will get a grip from ankle or pands and with other hand delariva player can choose their grip ( sleeve, collar?).

Second came could be with out second hands grip. Win for delariva player is getting opponent to touch both hands on the mat, get them to compat base. Win for "passer" is pinning. Reset if ankle is freed ( No de la riva).

I will be testing this next tuesday.

(If the game works, I will connect it to a sitting guard game.) Sitting guard has more possibilities for sweeps. Ankle pick, single leg, idiot sweep and so on.)

Games a very good source for eco games

Hey, thanks for putting this together. We've been experimenting with CLA at my club, and I can see this being really helpful with game design.

Do you have a link to the original table?

crossover, post: 65160, member: 10990

Next experiment will be to teach De La Riva to my training partner. She has done martial arts decades, but not so much grappling. Normally you don't "teach" a technique with eco or games. It's more like learning by doing and not naming the move, but more interested in outcome.

"De la Riva" is not a move. I think it as a control. So first assignment will be to control opponent in De la Riva. I do not care about delariva hook. So when controlling hook can come in. Person doing De la Riva will get a grip from ankle or pands and with other hand delariva player can choose their grip ( sleeve, collar?).

Second came could be with out second hands grip. Win for delariva player is getting opponent to touch both hands on the mat, get them to compat base. Win for "passer" is pinning. Reset if ankle is freed ( No de la riva).

I will be testing this next tuesday.

(If the game works, I will connect it to a sitting guard game.) Sitting guard has more possibilities for sweeps. Ankle pick, single leg, idiot sweep and so on.)

I'm looking to get my beginners (no gi) sweeping from bottom. They have only really done guard retaining and creating space to stand back up so far. I am struggling with how to give them live drills to start sweeping from open guard against a standing OR kneeling player. Does anyone have any advice of the sort of drills I could get them started with? I feel like they will be too overwhelmed with just saying "connect to the top player with hands and feel to put them on their hands or butt, top player has to get past the legs" thanks for any help in advance.

pleavindring, post: 65197, member: 29842

I'm looking to get my beginners (no gi) sweeping from bottom. They have only really done guard retaining and creating space to stand back up so far. I am struggling with how to give them live drills to start sweeping from open guard against a standing OR kneeling player. Does anyone have any advice of the sort of drills I could get them started with? I feel like they will be too overwhelmed with just saying "connect to the top player with hands and feel to put them on their hands or butt, top player has to get past the legs" thanks for any help in advance.

Bottom player tries to sweep and
A) make opponent post on mat.

B - version) make opponent sit on mat

C-version) sweep and get up before opponent.

Also top players constrsinds can be modified

pleavindring, post: 65197, member: 29842

I'm looking to get my beginners (no gi) sweeping from bottom. They have only really done guard retaining and creating space to stand back up so far. I am struggling with how to give them live drills to start sweeping from open guard against a standing OR kneeling player. Does anyone have any advice of the sort of drills I could get them started with? I feel like they will be too overwhelmed with just saying "connect to the top player with hands and feel to put them on their hands or butt, top player has to get past the legs" thanks for any help in advance.

Its blocking a leg or post or just pulling it away under opponent.

Worked my first game for de la riva. Did not go as I predicted. Much harder to unbalance. Next Thursday I will test it again.

Maybe some modifications:-)

I tried out Gregs eco games. Keeping chest to back and chest to chest. I only had two students.
It was a sweaty session for students. I did not talk much so it was a good session.

I do think that instructor needs to plan the games them self. We all have our own understanding of the mechanics and principles of grappling. If we want to improve students, we need to have a plan on what to teach. Its not techniques. Its concepts that come from games, but games need to be planned so that correct situations come.

I don’t think its wrong to give a hint on what might work. Student does not need to discover everything without help. Don’t need to show a technique, but maybe give an idea like try to loosen their grip…or something

Cool, I need to get more systematic abour these kind of situational drills. I have a spreadsheet for them, but haven't filled many in yet.

I am not a fan of going full eco teaching, so I've continued to have a chunk of class where I'm showing a technique, followed by a few mins for people to drill without resistance.

However, the warm up is now all situational drills. I go with four, where everybody gets a minute each. First one is side control: top tries to get mount, bottom tries to escape.

Then closed guard. Top tries to stand up, with their head free. Bottom tries to control top's posture and secure their head. Reset if either can achieve their goal for a few seconds.

Third is open guard. Top tries to pass, bottom tries to recover closed guard. No sweeps, submissions or half guard.

Fourth one depends on the position of the month. March is back control, so top has one arm and one leg in place, they're trying to get all four limbs into position. Bottom is trying to escape.

After showing a technique and doing some drilling without resistance, I move into situational drills to add in resistance. So far I've been using enter, secure and finish as my broad categories for those drills. Still playing around with it.

One big idea I am trying to use in ”drilling” is to have three options. 1. what happens if opponent gives no resistance. 2. What happens if opponent is pushing or attacking and 3. what opens if opponent is pulling or escaping.

I think its very difficult to learn and teach how to ”take” what opponent is giving you. We often just force our technique. We need to ”force” a reaction and use it. Eco teaches us to read opponents. Maybe information based approach teaches more how to ”write”?

Maybe some of you will be interested in this. I recently wrote an article about games for improving your stand up skills. Some are fairly easy and some are hard. I tried to give some ways to increase or decrease the difficulty as well for each of them.

Improve your takedowns through games

That was really good

kalel, post: 65153, member: 3023

It would be interesting to read about your experiments and experiences and see the different games you use and how well your students do :)

Hi, all. I've been leading a mostly eco/constraints-based class for about 2.5 years now. In general, I would say we have had great results in that time span. Class is only an hour, we get a great workout in, get experience with all positions, and the few that have competed from our class have won local events. The academy owner has also commented that our group is a menace when they drop in with other classes.

Thanks to the others contributing in here! I have been using some of your ideas, stealing those I can find from others (Greg Souders, Rob Biernacki, etc.) and designing my own. Someone suggested airtable (free) to me as a way to organize records and I have about 150 of them broken down by position. Rather than post individual games, I thought I'd just share my airtable database now. Please comment if you have recommendations to build off these or make them more effective.

Here you go.

lateroller, post: 65509, member: 32141

Hi, all. I've been leading a mostly eco/constraints-based class for about 2.5 years now. In general, I would say we have had great results in that time span. Class is only an hour, we get a great workout in, get experience with all positions, and the few that have competed from our class have won local events. The academy owner has also commented that our group is a menace when they drop in with other classes.

Thanks to the others contributing in here! I have been using some of your ideas, stealing those I can find from others (Greg Souders, Rob Biernacki, etc.) and designing my own. Someone suggested airtable (free) to me as a way to organize records and I have about 150 of them broken down by position. Rather than post individual games, I thought I'd just share my airtable database now. Please comment if you have recommendations to build off these or make them more effective.

Here you go.

thank you so much for sharing this!

lateroller, post: 65509, member: 32141

Hi, all. I've been leading a mostly eco/constraints-based class for about 2.5 years now. In general, I would say we have had great results in that time span. Class is only an hour, we get a great workout in, get experience with all positions, and the few that have competed from our class have won local events. The academy owner has also commented that our group is a menace when they drop in with other classes.

Thanks to the others contributing in here! I have been using some of your ideas, stealing those I can find from others (Greg Souders, Rob Biernacki, etc.) and designing my own. Someone suggested airtable (free) to me as a way to organize records and I have about 150 of them broken down by position. Rather than post individual games, I thought I'd just share my airtable database now. Please comment if you have recommendations to build off these or make them more effective.

Here you go.

thank you so much for this

lateroller, post: 65509, member: 32141

Hi, all. I've been leading a mostly eco/constraints-based class for about 2.5 years now. In general, I would say we have had great results in that time span. Class is only an hour, we get a great workout in, get experience with all positions, and the few that have competed from our class have won local events. The academy owner has also commented that our group is a menace when they drop in with other classes.

Thanks to the others contributing in here! I have been using some of your ideas, stealing those I can find from others (Greg Souders, Rob Biernacki, etc.) and designing my own. Someone suggested airtable (free) to me as a way to organize records and I have about 150 of them broken down by position. Rather than post individual games, I thought I'd just share my airtable database now. Please comment if you have recommendations to build off these or make them more effective.

Here you go.

Wow! Very nice and thorough.

lateroller, post: 65509, member: 32141

Hi, all. I've been leading a mostly eco/constraints-based class for about 2.5 years now. In general, I would say we have had great results in that time span. Class is only an hour, we get a great workout in, get experience with all positions, and the few that have competed from our class have won local events. The academy owner has also commented that our group is a menace when they drop in with other classes.

Thanks to the others contributing in here! I have been using some of your ideas, stealing those I can find from others (Greg Souders, Rob Biernacki, etc.) and designing my own. Someone suggested airtable (free) to me as a way to organize records and I have about 150 of them broken down by position. Rather than post individual games, I thought I'd just share my airtable database now. Please comment if you have recommendations to build off these or make them more effective.

Here you go.

Omg this is awesome! Thanks mate!